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Contributor II

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

Folks,

 

yes, indeed, there is a limit to what you can do and should do - if you are sitting for the third or fourth time, you may need to reconsider if you are really suited for the roles that a CISSP can have. Also note that you may still be a security professional, but perhaps other directions / certifications may be more in accordance with your capabilities and experience.

 

BTW, all this somewhat reminds me of a story I heard years ago from a psychiatrist that worked for Mensa.  He told me there are some gifted people (e.g. IQ's in the range of 110-120) that would love to be Mensa members, but simply do not pass the test. They will try, and try, and try again, learn some of the questions by heart, learn the style and format of questions and one day - they may pass. Now, their intelligence has not increased - but they learned how to do an intelligence test.

 

The question then remains if such people feel 'at home' with Mensa and the folks that they meet there. I don't think so. Likewise, if you try, try, and try again - perhaps 4, 5 or more times, and then finally pass the exam, you will probably not feel very much 'at home' with security professionals. Apart from the question if you can show the experience, get endorsed etc.

 

So, yes, try, try and try again - the reconsider. Good advice!

--
Heinrich W. Klöpping, MSc CISSP CCSP CIPP/E SCI
Newcomer III

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

"If you are sitting for the third or fourth time, you may need to reconsider if you are really suited for the roles that a CISSP can have."

I wholeheartedly DISAGREE with that statement. I have worked with candidates who have failed the exam three and four times. In each case, I found there was a negative mindset that was defeating them before they even reached the exam centre. These people were all InfoSec professionals with a minimum of 10 years career experience. So how on earth did they fail??? MINDSET.

When I was preparing for the 6-hr CISSP, I read all the stuff about it being incredibly hard and 95% fail on first attempt and some such whatever...and ignored it ALL! I determined that I was going to pass and threw myself into my studies, which included doing 4x 6hr practice exams. I sequestered myself in a hotel the day before, had a BIG meal, watched TV, did NO study...and went to bed with a photoshopped CISSP cert with my name on it and the exam date on my bedside table. I passed the next day. #mindset #dontgiveup #yesyoucan
Community Champion

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

I have entire threads and a litany of commentaries dedicated to warning people not to absorb negative information. People who post negativity designed to discourage others are problematic in the InfoSec field and budding professionals need to understand that. When I sat for my exam, I had only prepared with the Shon Harris book and ISC2 flash cards. I was also armed with my experience over a long military career. By the time that I was done with the exam, I knew that I had passed and the whole experience was very uneventful to me. I have found that when you absorb negativity from other people, all you have done is raised your stress level on exam day. Again, STAY AWAY FROM NEGATIVE PEOPLE, and that becomes a force multiplier to your benefit!

Lamont Robertson
M.S., M.A., CISSP, CISM, CISA, CRISC
Community Champion

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

And again, one might find CISSP's in a litany of roles. Some of the more critical people one might find pitching negativity are serving in ‘analyst’ roles, and there’s a reason for that. The CISSP is designed to prepare InfoSec professionals for the ‘C-Suite’ or other high-level managerial role. I failed to see how discouraging people that you manage will help you or your organization overall.

Lamont Robertson
M.S., M.A., CISSP, CISM, CISA, CRISC
Contributor II

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

@d46j48fx: again, if you are sitting for the third or fourth time, you need to reconsider. Because there definitely is something wrong then.  Can be anything: perhaps you really don't know how to study, or you aren't dedicated, or your knowledge of the language if insufficient, or you don't have, as you point out, the proper mindset. Perhaps the stuff is way over your head. Perhaps it is simply too much (it is a mile wide, after all), or you feel it's boring.  Perhaps personal circumstances aren't good. Whatever. But there is something wrong and all the cheering and backpatting of the world will not help, unless you find the root cause first.

 

Please note that whatever is wrong probably makes you less fit to forfill your role as a infosec professional too! For example, the gentleman you mentioned, that had a negative mindset - didn't that have impact on his work? I think it did. Likewise, if you can't properly judge if you are ready for the exam, not even after having tried it three times, are you fit to help judge risk at work then? Etcetera.

 

I therefore maintain that reconsidering and doing the analysis why you fail is very important. And also, if you do this analysis, you may want to seek some assistance of a teacher, tutor and/or infosec professional.  And be honest. Be prepared to have to face it that this indeed may not be for you. What's the use of sitting a fourth, fifth or umpteenth exam if you did not find the root cause of your consecutive failures, or if you did, can't change it? In such cases, yes, indeed: give up. You were brave, you tried, tried again, tried again, reconsidered - and found out you aren't fit for it (yet?). Nothing wrong, continue your life, perhaps do other certifications, or study on another level. And perhaps, one day, you're fit to be a CISSP, or perhaps you discovered you don't need it anymore, as you are now something "far better" Man Very Happy

 

Mind you, being positive is a great thing, and I believe we should try to be positive and encouraging as much as we can.  But you can not obliterate incapacities or incompetence by cheering and encouraging. And by being afraid of calling a cow a cow we do not achieve much either.

--
Heinrich W. Klöpping, MSc CISSP CCSP CIPP/E SCI
Newcomer III

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

I will NOT accept this mentality and neither should candidates. I maintain
my position and you can maintain yours.

Derek Lewinson, CISSP #598659
ICG | (C) 416-560-4779 | (E) djl@icgcan.com
Community Champion

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

> d46j48fx (Newcomer II) posted a new reply in Customer Support on 08-16-2018

> "If you are sitting for the third or fourth time, you may need to reconsider if
> you are really suited for the roles that a CISSP can have."  I wholeheartedly
> DISAGREE with that statement. I have worked with candidates who have failed the
> exam three and four times.

I've had people in my seminars who had failed twice, and passed after the seminar.

(I've also had people in my seminars who had failed twice, and I knew why, and I
also knew they were *never* going to pass.  In one case it was someone the
hosting company wanted to have pass so that he could "teach" the seminar.  
Yeah, right.)

>  These people
> were all InfoSec professionals with a minimum of 10 years career experience.

OK, that's a new one on me.  I have never had personal experience of anyone
with 10 years actual infosec experience who didn't pass.  (Possibly after a bit of a
pep talk.)

>  I sequestered myslwd in a hotel the
> day before, had a BIG meal, watched TV, did NO study...

Good.

> and went to bed with a
> photoshopped CISSP cert with my name on it and the exam date on my bedside
> table.

Thank you, Norman Vincent Peale  :-)

The power of positive thinking can, certainly have an effect.  (Not enough to get
you through the exam if you don't have the experience, but definitely an effect.)


............
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Contributor II

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

Well, I am a bit worried now, as the tone of your reply is almost hostile, which is somewhat disturbing. Seems I hit a nerve there, I'm sorry for that. 

 

Then, lets indeed agree to disagree. I say, our lives are way to precious to waste time on an endeavour that is, perhaps in hindsight, rather over ones head. If you have to sit a silly exam three or even more times, you are IMHO wasting your precious time, unless you know what is the root cause of your failure and have ensured to eliminate that first.  But that is something that should already have been done before you even try a second time.

 

Universities mostly do not even allow you to sit an exam more then twice. And if you have to sit for the second time, you can never achieve more than a simple "pass", no honours, no matter how well you do the second time.  Failed again? You're out, period. Man Surprised .. that's what keeps at title or accreditation valuable, methinks.

 

Perhaps we should introduce something similar for the (ISC)² certifications, it would really boost the certificate, I think.

 

Again, sorry to have offended you, I apologize.

 

--
Heinrich W. Klöpping, MSc CISSP CCSP CIPP/E SCI
Newcomer III

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment

Not hostile at all; just agreeing to disagree. You didn't hit a nerve...I just reiterated my strong disagreement with the view expressed; nothing more. Tone is one of the hardest things to ascertain in a non-visual environment...hence the popularity of emojies 🙂. I passed the 6-hr CISSP first time but I empathise with those for whom it is a struggle. No matter what is temporarily (because nothing is permanent except death and taxes LOL) preventing folks from passing the test, I cannot support a "give up" mentality...I refuse to give up on something just because it's beating me temporarily. I will do the work, I will adjust my mentality appropriately and I will apply tenacity, determination and faith until I have attained what I aspire to. I encourage candidates who are struggling to do the same.
Community Champion

Re: Failed CISSP - big time disappointment


@fortean wrote:

Universities mostly do not even allow you to sit an exam more then twice. And if you have to sit for the second time, you can never achieve more than a simple "pass", no honours, no matter how well you do the second time.  Failed again? You're out, period. Man Surprised .. that's what keeps at title or accreditation valuable, methinks.

 

Perhaps we should introduce something similar for the (ISC)² certifications, it would really boost the certificate, I think.


In fact, that's already pretty much what ISC2 does.  The CISSP, at least, is of a type that certifies you as a simple pass/fail.  Neither you, nor anyone else, knows what you got on the exam if you passed.

 


............
This message may or may not be governed by the terms of
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